Tweet
No reason to let a valid discussion die... Credit to Skeletorous for starting this off!
-
36Yes! I'd love it if Mattel would let the Power & Honor Foundation do more!97.22%35No! I am content with just the initial volume.2.78%1 -
Absolutely! This is one of my favorite MOTU collectibles and probably my favorite archival book based on a property. It's just so gorgeous, informative, and well produced. I sometimes will go through spells where I keep this on my nightstand simply because I love to look at it before I drift off to sleep! -
First, I would like the first volume to be readily available to fans that don't have it. Right now it's just a chase item and is extremely expensive if one is lucky enough to find one.
Second, I would love to see a second volume, but ONLY if Neitlich has NOTHING to do with it. If his name or image is in the book, I wouldn't want it. Unfortunately Mattel will probably have to have it's corporate stamp on it somehow... I can deal with that.Comment
-
There's no sane reason why anyone would be against this.“A society that gets rid of all its troublemakers goes downhill." ― Robert A. HeinleinComment
-
For anyone not familiar with the Power and Honor Foundation's amazing catalog, here is a review that Pixel Dan did a few years ago of Volume 1.
"We must always value life. Even the life of one who opposes us." ― He-ManComment
-
Of course I'd like to see more, I have the first one and it's an absolute treasure.Comment
-
Honestly, Mattel shouldn't have anything to do with what the Power and Honor Foundation decides to do. The P&H Foundation is independent, and should be able to release whatever it wants... if the guys at Mattel's don't have these designs and drawings, then they should just shut up and let other people live. It's really too sad that a crappy company has to be so totalitarian and such a control freak...Last edited by Widukind; 03-25-2014, 07:21 PM.Comment
-
Agreed, if most of the collected material was abandoned by the company, legally they don't have the ownership to it, at least that's the general notion from what I know. Now how the material was obtained in the first place is probably how they're trying to find the loopholes to get around stopping P&H Foundation from publishing further volumes. Anyhow it still shows how scumbag Scott is as a person...Originally posted by Widukind View PostComment
-
Well, there's the legal issue that all the established characters and distinctive licenses are trademarks/copyrights of Mattel, so that causes a whole lot of hurdles in publishing the stuff. Their cooperation, at least tacitly, seems to me to be required. And it seems there are further issues given how limited their own artbook had to be. It could be a whole welter of rights issues--typical for MotU.Comment
-
I voted "yes". Even if not for me, I believe every MOTU fan worthy of that name would deserve to get a chance at owning such valued document, done by those who really care about MOTU beyond numbers or personal agendas.“Freedom of speech doesn't protect speech that you like, freedom of speech protects speech that you hate." ― Ron JeremyComment
-
I would love one. What about all those "UNOFFICIAL" fan released books I see? Print that book out in Sweden, Cambodia - any country that does not care about American copyright. You know, Scooter will not be in MOTU Mattel forever, I know I am not getting sub next year and you can see all the people stuck with excess figures this year and it's only March.“Anything is a dildo, if you're brave enough"
― Thomas Jefferson
Always looking to trade MOTUC to complete my collection.Comment
-
Well, I'm sure the P&HF has a better idea than us as to why they might have to consult with Mattel before publishing the book. It would be interesting to hear what Mattel wants out of the deal in return for allowing it to happen. If the P&HF and Mattel can't agree on terms, then I'd bet that Mattel or Neitlich...whoever they are directly dealing with, wants something completely ridiculous and unacceptable. If they are dealing directly with Neitlich, then the book will never happen. Let's not forget how spiteful he is.
Again, How were they allowed to publish the first book... did the P&HF have to go through the same BS with that one too?Comment
-
Not sure why Mattel are so shortsighted. Of course people would want this! Get on board, I say...Comment
-
Mattel has always been shortsighted."If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all." ― Noam ChomskyComment
-
I remember reading somewhere--I think it was a review of Toyland or Toy Wars--that said Mattel was the more 'corporate' of the big two, and Hasbro the more laid-back. Hasbro certainly seems to have better fan relations, even if they're not perfect.Originally posted by Draego-Man View PostComment
-
Anyone know if the P&HF had to get Mattel's permission to publish the first volume?
The demand is definitely there. I'd have to guess that Mattel isn't the only stumbling block. I will assume that the P&HF want to publish the next book on a MUCH grander scale, but they can't without getting Mattel's permission. Why does the P&HF want to go bigger??? Possibly to raise more money this time around... I will give them the BOTD and say NOT FOR PROFIT... but you never know. That Castle moat had quite a mark up IMO... and mark ups are usually for profits. Not complaining though.Comment
-
We didn't get permission to do the first Catalog. We simply did it. It's was catalog of a private collection, not for sale, not distributed in stores.Originally posted by Anti-Guru View Post
Risky? Yes. But we knew what were going into.
​Mattel's stance is that we can't do much of anything without their permission and they have no intention of giving it (they wanted to give us permission to keep collecting and display toys…)The demand is definitely there. I'd have to guess that Mattel isn't the only stumbling block. I will assume that the P&HF want to publish the next book on a MUCH grander scale, but they can't without getting Mattel's permission.
Bigger means wider audience. We’re sure books like these would sell a lot more if they could be found in bookshops, comic shops, Amazon etc. We want more people to enjoy them. But that is another topic. The problem is not going bigger, sorry if I was confusing in my previous comments. The problem is being able to do something at all.Why does the P&HF want to go bigger??? Possibly to raise more money this time around...
I will give them the BOTD and say NOT FOR PROFIT... but you never know. That Castle moat had quite a mark up IMO... and mark ups are usually for profits. Not complaining though.Last edited by Emiliano; 03-28-2014, 02:51 PM.Comment
-
Thank you for the breakdown above...
-Has Mattel tried to take legal action against the P&HF for the release of the first book?
-Can you go into negotiation details regarding the second book with Mattel... What is the P&HF asking for, and what is Mattel asking for?
-Were/are the negotiations directly with Scott Neitlich or someone else or another group of people from Mattel?Comment
-
They threatened, never took actual legal action.Originally posted by Anti-Guru View Post
This is what I can say:-Can you go into negotiation details regarding the second book with Mattel... What is the P&HF asking for, and what is Mattel asking for?
we didn’t try negotiate a second volume. We asked for a license to do multiple volumes and exhibitions. So a regular license, like any other licensor, with all the usual terms (Mattel approval etc.)
Mattel refused. Not refused our terms, they flat out said they are not interested in giving us a license.
That's why I can talk about it. There are no negotiations going on and we reached no agreement. We remain open to work with them, but they first need to be interested.
The alternative would be being able to work with another publisher as producers of such books, were the license is handled by the publisher.
But when the chance presented for this, Mattel prohibited that we could be actively involved.
Everything went through our lawyers, we never had direct contact with anybody at Mattel after a meeting 3 years ago. Except for the product I was mentioning above, but I won’t talk more about it until it’s announced (in respect of the other company involved).-Were/are the negotiations directly with Scott Neitlich or someone else or another group of people from Mattel?
I talked to Scott that time, and it didn't go well at all.Comment
-
Absolutely!
I love volume one.
Some of my favorite figures in MOTUC are the concept ones, simply because of the history behind them..... and a lot of that can be attributed to the P&H book (especially in the case of Vykon , as I'd have a harder time stomaching the 'space' and 'tank' costumes otherwise).
...I can't help but wonder if there are others that feel the same way as me, and could wind up having a greater appreciation for more concept characters in MOTUC if there were more P&H type books. More P&H books would help make a greater audience of fans aware of potential new figures, but I'm sure Neitlich would rather have the artwork in his possession so he could pass off the ideas as his own. That would be Mattel's M.O.: pass up sales out of short-sightedness, and in the case of Neitlich, pass up sales simply out of spite.
Please Emiliano, you have got to explain the "they wanted to give us permission to keep collecting....". That sentence alone makes Mattel sound like such arrogant asses, that there's got to be a hilarious and sad (sad, as in pathetic on Mattel's part) story behind it.Comment
-
Granted, not all Non-Profits are truly interested in promoting their cause over making a profit. Look at what a scam the Red Cross is, I would never give a penny to an organization that pays it's directors millions of dollars in salary a year. Guide Star used to be an outstanding site to use - but unfortunately, now they charge.“Anything is a dildo, if you're brave enough"
― Thomas Jefferson
Always looking to trade MOTUC to complete my collection.Comment
-
Here's the issue with a non-profit that I feel most people don't understand: They still typically have to make a profit of some kind to fund their activities or have a revenue stream coming in, otherwise they have nothing to work with. A non-profit doesn't mean that the organization does everything for free nor that no one working for the organization gets paid; it instead means that 1. the organization's purpose is not solely to make money and 2. the ultimate decision makers for the organization cannot profit from the organization . Typically that's the board of directors if it's a private non-profit.
I work for a non-profit and have worked with many non-profits. Money is a real issue. I've worked with non-profit organizations that received grants (federal, state, and private) and non-profits that had to self sustain through fundraising, donations, and self supporting programs like selling. Every time someone tries to bring up something up regarding a non-profit charging money, remember. How does that non-profit pay their staff? How does that non-profit pay their electric and utility bills? How does that non-profit accomplish their mission? If, like the P&H foundation, their job is collecting, gathering, and preserving, remember that that is not an inexpensive procedure. It requires money to acquire art and special tools to restore and preserve it.
Unlike some non-profits, for the P&H Foundation their surely aren't government and state grants that fund their programs. Religious and activist organizations are not sending a portion of their budgets to fund the P&F's activities. When the P&F does a fundraiser, that's how they get the funds to accomplish their mission. Otherwise, what exactly are they supposed to do? Unless you're actively donating to them, they're not having income coming in.
Also, the Red Cross spends a little less than 10% of it's nearly 3.5 billion on staff and administration in the last full year of records, FYI.Comment
-
By no means was I saying that the P & H Foundation do anything wrong, they deserve to make some money to keep them going.
Emiliano is accessible and I have no doubt whatsoever that this organization is all about the history and fandom of MOTU.
The Tampa Bay Tribune recently ran an amazing expose' on charities and the bad apples. I had no idea that 90 percent of charities that use telemarketers are pretty much scum.
-
-
There isn't much to explain on that. It's really exactly what I said. In the deal they offered us, the wanted to grant us the permission to keep collecting. It was about the only thing they were going to allow, along with displaying toys. That's it.Originally posted by Croc-O-Bite! View PostComment
-
Basically, Scott and Mattel are bullies who threaten legal action every chance they can. You know what? Some public shaming would do them some good, this would be a great article to drop right around San Diego Comic Con so that Scott has to face the music when all the media are there. -
Companies trying to threaten legal action on small issues like this are really getting out of hand. Many larger companies retain legal teams simply to use the threat of legal action to preserve their brand, even if they have no actual legal basis. They just assume (and rightly so) that smaller companies and groups won't challenge them due to expenses.
-
-
So if they didn't 'grant you permission to keep collecting' do they think they can make you stop collecting the art they don't even own anymore? Because that's how that statement is coming across to me...Comment
-
Of course not. They have no power physical or legal to prevent us from collecting (notice the permission included collecting the toys). These corporations have a very specific language. You know it's BS, I know it's BS, they know it's BS. But they also know they're in a power position, so they just think they can afford saying this stuff to us. The only result was that nothing ever concretized. We understand allowing these books won't make much money for them. But at the same time, it won't damage them or create any issue. It would only increase brand awareness in a way that is absolutely common in Japan, and only happened with Transformers in the western world.Originally posted by Croc-O-Bite! View PostComment
Comment